I still want the car to have some cornering ability (mostly to make up for my bad driving).  So I won't be doing anything like using a 4 cylinder front sway bar.  I have a Maximum Motorsports strut tower brace and also their 4 point K-member brace.

My subframe connectors are kind of weak.  I have BBK bolt ons.  They are okay for now, but long term (when I have some stress cracks welded up) I may replace them or have them welded in. 

I want to get some Wild Rides battle boxes for the upper and lower control arms (cash register sound) $ 300.  I'll probably get Ford Motorsports Upper control arms and Maximum motorsports Lower control arms. 

That's kind of where I run out of direction.  I have pocket ported Windsor Jr.'s and a Crane 2020 cam.  It's a pretty mild setup, so I don't know what kind of traction problems I'll have with 3.55 gears. 

I'm still trying to learn what kind of traction stuff is available. If I do have traction problems, here is what I'm considring doing.  MM has a panhard bar and a torque arm, so I may go for those (cash register sound) $460 + $330.  They say you can't use them with bolt in sub frame connectors and the torque arm needs a panhard bar which needs to be at least as good as their's (that's why I'll probably buy their's).

My $1,500 85 LX will have $8500 in it once I do these suspension mods and replace the rear end.  I'll bet you it's still too slow to suit me when all is said and done.  

Your coup sounds great.  What kind of power plant do you have in there?

The Coupe was being built to run NMRA Pure street. That was a few years age though. They are going a lot faster then I'm going to be able to go. It has a 308. With AFR 165 heads, and an Anderson  n-5p cam. A Weiand Stealth intake, and a Holley 650 DP. I have Kooks 1 3/4" headers on it with a x pipe and Dyno Max Bullet mufflers with turn downs. The tranny is a Tremec TKO. The rear has 33 spline Moser axles, and 4.30 gears. I'm guessing it will run mid 11's on the motor. I hope so anyway. I'm going to put nitrous on it at some point. I want the car to run mid to low 10's. Then I 'll be happy with it. I haven't done a K member on it yet. When I was building it the rule said that you had to run a stock k member. Then they changed that to stock controll arms Now you can run Coil overs up front. It's to crazy for me to even think about trying to keep up with them. The top guy's now are going mid 10's. No power adders allowed. So I'll make it a strip/street car. It has a manual rack in it. No heater core. Not much of any thing. So I get so I can drive it on the street but I won't want to drive it very far.

I like Maximum Motorsports's stuff. I really like there adjustable controll arms. I'm just shocked that they don't make upper controll arms. I got the Mega bite stuff because of the adjustability. The Mega Bite uppers are adjustable so you can change the pinion angle of the rear. The Mega Bite JR lowers I have can be adjusted between two settings on the back of the controll arm. Where it mounts to the rear. It has two holes. The first hole is said to give 60%? better traction. The second hole is said to give a 110% better traction. I don't know if it's true yet though. I really like the QA1 shocks and struts. They are light, 12 way adjustable and can be switched to coil over easily. The thing is that they aren't cheap.

Just get your frame rail conectors weld in. Once thats done I don't think that you'll have a problem.

I think you should consider 3.73's instead of 3.55's with your set up. Your highway running won't be that much different. You will get a little better jump out of the hole though. Traction will be an issue. Once you get upper and lowers that will help. You're going to need some kind of sticky tire too. I don't know how much you drive your car but I have the Nitto Drag radials on the Cobra. I love em. They're good in the turns. They're ok in the rain. If your car isn't a daily driver then look into a set. They really do work good.

I was a little surprised that Maximum Motorsports didn't offer an upper control arm too.  But, that's sort of what made me trust them a little more.  Instead of claiming that everything they made was the best, they flat out state that they found that the Ford Motorsports Upper control arm was the best.  So they sell the Motorsports upper.  They make up for it with the lower control arm though, it seem more expensive than others I have priced. 

3.73's are tempting ... I have 2 new Bridgestone tires on the back and I'll move those to the front when I wear out the 'Hankyo' or whatever it is that I have in front.  I do use the car as a daily driver when I feel like it, so I'm looking for some sticky tires which will wear well.   Nitto is one of the brands I hear about a lot.

So what are the NMRA Pure street guys doing now that makes them so much faster?   Is it mostly supension or are they changing the rules on the motors?

I don't know the specs on the Anderson cam, but that sounds like a nicely setup motor.  Is the bottom end stock?

The NMRA guys are running ultra light weight rods and pistons. They have done all they can to the heads. Which isn't a lot, but you know it isn't cheap either. The cams have a .500 max lift. My cam is .498 lift with 288 intake duration and 294 exhaust. With a 108 lobe center.  My cam was good a few years ago, not now. They run the newer cams that let them turn there motor's well over 7 grand. There suspension is all top of the line stuff. They spend hours and hours on the dyno. Always looking for a way to pick up that extra tenth. I don't have the time our the backing to even try to keep up with that. I would have to tear it all down and start over. To hope to be more then first round bait. That's not even going for a win. Plus by the time I changed, they would have changed the rules again and I'd still be behind the 8 ball. So I'm just going to but nitrous on it and have a fun car. I'll run it in open comp when it's done. That's not as much fun as heads up racing is, but I'll have a chance for a win everytime I go race. Yes the bottom end is stock. Well except for the pistons of course. They're nothing trick just forged 40 over flat top pistons.

As long as you don't have to drive it every day then I'd say the nitto's would be the way to go. I've had my DR's on the car for going on three  years now. I don't drive a lot of miles but I do drive it.

If Maximum recommends the Ford uppers that strongly then go with it. I've been told and believe to pick a suspension company and stay with them. Because if you try to make it up on your own then you have a big chance you'll mess it up. Some parts may not work well together. If you stay with one company they already know what works and what doesn't.

Do you plan to add a blower or nitrous at some point? If you're thinking a blower then maybe stay with the 3.55's. Well really there isn't much difference. That rear I told you to go after had 3.55's in it. I raced that car a lot. I would get done my shift and then he would shift. If you know what I'm trying to say. That is the difference between the two gears. At 70mph I turn around 2400 rpm. in 5th gear with the 3.73's. 

I get the impression that every time they come up with an attempt at a true street class racing event, that it very quickly gets screwed up by politics and advertising controlling everything. 

I would think the closer they kept the bottom end to stock, the more they could control the class.  It sounds like as long as you can race your car and win some and lose some you can have fun.  I'd stick to the open class.  I think it would be a lot of work to run NMRA and  just run once in the rst round.  I'm surprised they could ruin a class so quickly though.

I don't plan on any power adders.  My engine is kind of old.  I put new heads on it and I think I got away with it.  It doesn't burn any oil yet, so I have my fingers crossed.  If I manage to do this motor in, I might get a 331.  Anyhow, the motor does seem to be holding up well.  I guess the stock forged pistons are fairly durable.

I know what you mean about racing a car and trading shifts with the other guy.  The gearing sounds really close. 

My 85 has smaller wheels that your Cobra, so when I plug the numbers into one of those, RPM calculators, I come up with 2440 RPM's at 75 with a 3.55 rear end.  At 100 it would be 3250 RPM's.  I measured my tire diameter at 24.75. 

I called local rear end shop up today.  They wanted $1100 to rebuild an 8.8 rear end - basically, he would have replaced everything (31 spline) and I would have had to supply an 8.8 inch rear end.  I can buy a new rear end from summit for $795 (M4006-B373 or M4006-B355).

Yeah, but it's the nature of heads up drag racing. To be competitive you have to out work and really out spend the next guy. The ruels said that you could run any pistion you wanted. Except for a dome pistions. Well when they can out with the light weight pistions. Every went to them becausee the rules didn't say you couldn't. Then the same thing happened with the rods. You could run any stock lenght you wanted os everyone went to the light weight stuff to gain alittle advantage. You have to do it just to keep up. If you want to winn you have to look in the gray area of the rule for that little edge. I just can't even keep up. I would like to get a pass in under leagle trim. Just to see were I'd stand. Then I'm going to bottle feed it and have fun.

That rear from Summit looks like a good deal. I couldn't get any info on though. Is it a stock rear with gears? Even if it is I don't think you'll have to much of a problem. I raced my stock rear for a long time before I broke it. As long as you don't run slicks or even cheater slicks. I think you'd be ok. If it has 31 spline axles it's a no brainer. 1100 Is alot to do a rear I think. Eric gave you a price 800 or 900? Know that I think about it maybe it isn't that bad. Eric can do it cheap because his overhead is very low. He doesn't pay rent or anything for the shop. That I know of anyway. If he does it's to his Mom. So you know cheap. That could be the difference.

You tires are only 24.75 inch diameter? I thought they all had 26 inch diameter. An inch and a quarter isn't much but I guess it's enough to make a difference.

I think I'm going to go over to Eric's tomorrow. I need a new clutch cable. So I'll talk to him and see what he thinks. I'll let you know what he says if anything.  

I'd appreciate you getting a price from Eric.  I didn't get a price from him because he didn't have any core 8.8 rear ends available to base the price on. Plus I wasn't sure at that time exactly what sort of mods would be useful.  Thanks for bringing me up to speed on this one.

31 spline

extra clutches

I'll buy an aluminum cover later....

I'll measure my tires diameter again.  Maybe I was asleep at the wheel the first time. (No pun intended.)

I talked to Eric. He still doesn't have any core's. He made some calls about getting some put the guy didn't get back to him. The thing is that they are hard to come by. I don't know why with all of the 5.0 cars built you would think that we be tripping over them. Not the case at all. For him to get a new case it's 500 bucks. So by the time he builds it your looking at 14 to 15 hundred bucks. No one want's to spend that kind of money. He did make a call though to see about buying 5 to 10 core's. Give it a few days and give him a call to see if the deal went through. He did say that the summit deal is a real good price. We looked up the Moser deal for $820. That was for a 9 inch, not a 8.8. He even called Moser to see if they had any 8.8 housings. They don't carry them. He was getting ready to ship a nice rear today. The guy had his old rear shipped up from Ga. They were just waiting for the cover that the guy wanted to come in. They were out of stock. He is getting his shipping really cheap. So maybe 100 bucks to Ca. is about right. Maybe try calling some junkyards around there to see if there are any 8.8's to be had cheap. If you could get one for around a 100 or so then it would be worth getting and sending out.  

Thanks for checking that out.

The only housing I saw was from Currie.  $450 for an 8.8 with 9 inch axle covers.  I don't which axle would work with that.

M-4204-F318  8.8 differential and spool 31 tooth w traction lock   $ 299

... not including gears, it's already near the price of a new one from Summit.

I believe that the Moser deal for the $ 820 9 inch does not include gears.  Also, I talked to a guy who put a Moser kit in and he needed adjustable control arms to get the pinion angle correct.  Also, (I believe) the brackets where the control arms hooked up were larger, so the control arms were pretty specialized.  It almost sounds worth doing though.

I'll bet your motor has tons more grunt to it than mine, so chances are a 28 spline 8.8 will be just fine for me. 

You don't need a 9 inch. They take more power to turn anyway. The right 8.8 can take all the power any street car will through at it. I am putting out more power then you right now, but I broke my rear before the blower went on the car. I was at Atco raceway in NJ. It's a hole of a track but it is on of the fastest tracks around. The starting line has get traction. This night it was really good. My first pass of the night I didn't have a chance to let the air out of my Hoosier Quick Time's. I staged the car and didn't think it would hook at all so I came out at around 2800 rpm and bogged the motor. So I thought this is it I'm going for the 12's tonight. The car at this point was running 13.40's 13.30's. The next time up I had the air pressure at 14 PSI. I just so happened to be lined up with a very sweet 69 z/28. I noticed that he had the same tires on as I did. I knew it was going to be a good race. I even heard the announcer talking about the match up. So I did a good burn out and staged the car. Once staged I brought it up to 5 grand. The last yellow light and I let it fly. All I heard was BANG. I thought It popped out of gear so I jam it back into 1st and went for it again. Then I felt the crunching felling coming from the back end. I knew at that point that something broke. I got out and we tried to push the car off of the track there was know moving it. We han to get the floor jack out to push it off the track. My friend was right behind me. I told him to make it a good pass because we were out of there. He staged and bang. He blew the tail shaft off of his trans. Now we're stuck there. I had to call my wife at 10 o'clock at night and ask her to get in the car and drive an hour and a half to a place that she's never been to to pick us up. Tell me if that didn't suck. So while we were waiting. We meet this guy that worked a a local Ford dealer. He said that he could hook us up. We though cool. The next day we towed the cars to his dealer. I told him I wanted 31 spline axles since I had to replace them anyway. ( I snapped the end of the stock axle right off.) He said ok. When they called and said it was done I went to pick up the car. It said they only replaced one axle. I said????????. They came back with one makes 31 spline axles for a Cobra. What ever it was to late now the car was done. Within days the rear started to make all kinds of noise. So after living with it for about a month. I found Jim ( Eric's Dad) I talked to him he said I got ripped off. He got me the 31 spline axles and did every thing. It was cheaper then it was to get the one axle replaced. That was ten years ago now. Still no problems. knock knock. So my point with that long boring story was you do have enough power to break a stock 28 spline rear. The thing is I had sticky tires on, plus the track had a ton of traction compound on it and I was going for the kill. Take any one of those thing out and the rear would have lived. You know how you plan to drive the car. If you don't plan to do that much racing then you'll be perfictly fine with the 28 spline rear. Plus if you do plan to step up the power at some other point you'll already have the housing just upgrade it with the good stuff then. I really don't see how you're going to beat that summit deal.

That night sounds like a big adrenalin rush.  It's funny how much detail you can remember when your mind gets whirring like that.

The way I figure it, either Summit or a local Ford dealership which carries Ford racing products will be pretty competitive.  The pricing is pretty close $769 for Summit (I mispoke) and $799 for Ford.  The shipping charge may make the difference.  Summit usually drop ships from one of their warehouses in Nevada so hopefully that drops the shipping charge some.

In my 68 Camaro I had a really squealy fan belt at one point.  Some chick in a Firebird 400 pulled up next to me and wanted to race.  I pulled my idle up to 3000 RPM's and the fan belt was really squealing.  When the lady in the Firebird laughed at me I decided I was really going to hammer it.  I don't know how the Zoom clutch held together but I got through the intersection before I let the clutch all the way out.  The car was just about completely sideways when I finally popped the clutch and floored it.  I think the Firebird hadn't even gotten through the 1st crosswalk yet. 

My car had one of those really lopey high duration 1960's style cams that wouldn't idle below 1,000 RPM's.   As my car sat there loping at the next light who do you think was laughing as the Firebird refused to make eye contact.   I think that was a really long light for her.  Any how, that gives you and idea of my driving style: lot's of clutch, lot's of wheel hop, not too much spinning (unless noise is the goal).  ... your basic bad driving ..

Ok now I'm pissed. I wrote this long message mostly Bs as usual, but I reread it to fix any type o's. Then I tried to post it and got a can't find the server message. I hit refresh. Then I got can't post a blank message. Haaaaaaaa. I hate that. I'm not even sure what I said. Ok I'll try to redo it.

I remember that night like it was yesterday. Mostly because it was a really bad night. You are right though the more I typed the more detail I remembered.

Your old Camaro sounded really nice. I have a thing for old Camaro's. I'd like to get a 68 SS with a 375 horse 396. The thing is the longer I wait the more they cost. A friend of mine had a 69 with a 502 in it. We went at it one night. It wasn't realy a race because we were nose to tail. We came off a light and he was in it and I was so far up his #ss that he couldn't see my head lights. I should have been able to walk me but something wasn't right with his car. He said it was laying over at 4500 rpm. We think it was starving for air. I didn't care I told him BS his car was a piece of S. I still give him a hard time about it. Now he's building a 71 Trans Am. I don't know why either but he's doing it. He just had the motor dyno'd. It made 570 something horses. So i guess it will be about 520 to the wheels. I'm trying to talk him into a turbo for it. I don't know if he will though. He's spent a fortune on it already and it's only half done.

I'm really thinking that that Ford or Summit deal would be the way to go. I'm not all that sure you'll even break it. If you ever do then go to the 31 splines. Lots of clutch is a good thing when it comes to making your rear last. With just street tires on it you won't break it. Remember I had cheater slicks and did a 5 grand launch to break mine. If you were going to have a rear rebuilt then go for the 31 splines the cost isn't much different. Since you have to but the hole thing it will be $400 to $500 more expensive to get a 31 spline rear.

Well it wasn't quite the same but it doesn't matter. Close enough.

That's pretty funny about your friends 502 going tits up over 4500 RPM's.  Now when he tells you that you can have a rematch anytime you want, you can ask him how many times are you going to have to beat him before he gives up.  Those factory 502's Chevy produces now are unreal.

I know what you mean about 396s, 502's and big block Firebirds / Camaro's.  I wish I could even afford one.  I remember when I had my Camaro, some guy was parking his 68 Charger with it's 370 HP 440 out in front of a gas station I worked in.  He had a for sale sign on it.  We brought it inside for him every night.  Looking back on it, I can't believe I never road tested it even once.  Of course, there was that one night where I decided I would just floor it out in back of the gas station from a stand still.  I thought it would seem tame next to my LT1.  The thing had stock tires and couldn't get traction to save it's life but what a torque monster. It started getting ready to grab traction and it was vibrating sideways.  I let off the gas and just idled it into the bay for the evening.  I must have turned around and looked at it two or three times as i was walking away.

Oh well, back to my little 5.0.  I thought I'd save my pennies and put in the battle boxes and lower control arms first.  But now, I say , screw it, since they'll cost me nearly $600 anyhow, I guess I'll just get the rear end off Summit.    With the 2 1/2 year old  I get (at best) a couple hours a weekend to work on the car.  ... with any luck, maybe it will go quickly.

As for gears, I have 15 inch wheels and I think your Cobra has 17 inch wheels, so the 3.55's are probably better for me.  I think that will get me similar freeway RPM's to your car.

Now after reading your post, I'm all paranoid about hitting reply and losing my message...just a bad internet week I guess...

Cool I don't feel so bad. I have a 2 year old. That's the biggest reason my coupe is still sitting, and my Cobra needs a clutch. It's tough to get anything done with little ones running all over the place. That's one of the reasons I went to Eric's the other day. I need to get back in the intercircle to get some work done. He's going to be breaking ground on a new shope behind his house. He's going to have a dyno a store front and a bigger shop. So I'm going to try to work for him at least part time in the store. Even if it's just to pay for parts and to work on the cars in the shop. I was very tight with his Dad. I would all but live there. I used to go to family dinners and every thing. When my Wife and I got together all of that just stopped. I'm really sorry that I did. Because Jim died and I didn't even find out about it until a few weeks after the fact. I still really regret not being there.  I did get to spend the day with him two weeks before he died. I do feel a little better about it because of that.

I kinda had the thing at a gas station I worked at. This gut brought over his 427 / 435HP 69 Vette. Convertable with a 4 speed. I used to pull it into the bay's every night. The car didn't have power steering though so it was a bull to pull around the lot. I did get to take it around the block once. Man what a car. We had the top down. It had side pipes on it. The exhaust note was unreal. It was the closest thing I've ever come to a Sc Cobra. The torque was the best part. What a fun car. He sold it right after that for 19 grand. That's cheap but it was way more then I had. Then there's all of the car's that I should of bought. I'd be here all night typing and getting more and more depressed. A 55 Chevy with a 427, Muncie 4 speed, and a 12 bolt for 2 grand. Is the biggest mistake.

Jeff ( the guy with the Camaro) is just a girl. He had a nitrous system in that car and never even hooked it up. He just want it because it looked cool. I tried and tried to get a drag pass in that car and he kept giving me reasons that we can't take it to the track yet. " We will though we will." It was all about the looks not the preformance. He was out in Washington state and saw the Trans Am. He bought it on the spot, and had it shipped across the country. Only to find out it was hit and the front clip was replaced. Now he speanding all this money on it. So he can take it to a few car show and look cool for a while then he'll sell it for a huge loss. I think he nuts, but it's not my money.  

That's funny.   I remember this bank teller who worked across the street from the gas station I used to work at was selling his 55 Chevy with it's 454 LS-7 for around  $1300 bucks.  It was during the gas crisis in the 70's and nobody wanted the car (except me).  It was right after I sold my Camaro and my dad would have killed me if I sold the Celica I just bought so I could buy that car.

427 tri power.  There's a dream car for you.  What a dilemna though.  If a magic genie gave me one of those cars what would I do with it?  In that Vette, you have one of the few 60's muscle cars that could be set up to swallow a big enough tire to perform up to it's potential.  I'm talking major fendor flares here....would you do it?   Would you at least put a cam and headers in it or would you be worried about the resale value.  Okay, I'll admit it, I stay up late worrying about stuff like this.   ... the mythical car I'll never own  .... or maybe I'll dream about putting a 408 in my super sleeper LX-stang .... then I fall out of bed and wake up ...

It sounds like getting a couple of night or weekend afternoon outings working at Eric's shop might be a good way to get a little hobby time for yourself and it'd probably help Eric out too. 

I'm still working on getting a kitchen pass myself...